Not All Hauntings Are the Same, Part Two | Grave Talks CLASSIC
The second part of a deep dive into the distinction between ghosts and spirits reveals a compelling theory: what we perceive as 'ghosts' may not be conscious entities, but rather trapped consciousnesses stuck in a loop—like a dream that never ends. Cale Epperson, a paranormal investigator from Oklahoma, draws a powerful analogy between recurring nightmares and the behavior of certain spirits, suggesting that traumatic deaths or obsessive attachments (to a chair, a car, or a location) can lock a spirit into a mental state that repeats the same moment over and over. He shares chilling cases, including a murdered waitress whose screams echo in a restaurant basement and a doorman who knows he’s dead and still plays poker with investigators. Yet, not all hauntings are bound by location—Epperson describes free-roaming spirits, like a lost boy with a chili bowl haircut, who appear in malls without any connection to the site. He argues that energy—both human and electromagnetic—may draw spirits to places like malls, where the lingering pulse of past crowds creates a psychic echo. While some unease in empty malls or schools may stem from primal human instincts, Epperson believes the emotional residue of intense human activity can linger in structures, creating a palpable atmosphere even without visible phenomena.
A ghost may be a consciousness stuck in a loop, like a recurring nightmare, unable to move past a traumatic moment or obsessive attachment.
Spirits that know they’re dead—like Russell the doorman—can communicate and interact, while 'ghosts' may be reliving a single event over and over.
Empty malls and schools can feel eerie not just from psychology, but from residual energy of past human activity that lingers in the structure.
EMF and electromagnetic fields from household devices can cause hallucinations, misinterpreted as paranormal activity—especially in children.
Free-roaming spirits, like a boy with a chili bowl haircut, may appear in places like malls without any historical connection to the location.
…and 3 more takeaways available in PodZeus
The Ghost vs. Spirit Divide
“I don't know. Maybe that has something to do with it. A lot of ghosts are attached to something, either an item or a building and rare occasions a person.”
The Dreamlike Loop of Hauntings
“It'll go on hours. I'll check the clock. It'll be midnight and then one, two, three, four, five. And it's still the same damn thing.”
Margaret and Russell: A Haunted Restaurant Case
“Russell knows he's dead. I mean, he'll flat. I forgot what question we asked him, but he responded back saying that he knew that he was dead. He was just happy being where he was at.”
Why Ghosts Are Drawn to Malls
Epperson discusses why spirits might appear in abandoned or active malls—possibly drawn by residual human energy, the memory of past crowds, or the desire to blend in with life.
Energy, EMF, and the Psychology of Empty Spaces
The episode examines whether eerie feelings in vacant malls and schools come from human psychology, residual energy, or actual paranormal presence, with Epperson arguing for a blend of both.
“But Russell knows he's dead. I mean, he'll flat. I forgot what question we asked him, but he responded back saying that he knew that he was dead. He was just happy being where he was at.”
“It'll go on hours. I'll check the clock. It'll be midnight and then one, two, three, four, five. And it's still the same damn thing.”
“And the easiest way I can explain it, like if I go into a room and I feel like there's a lot of tension, like you get that feeling like somebody doesn't want me here. I tell my investigators, like have you ever been up on an aggressive person who is mad and you feel that tension coming off that person? It's the same way with a ghost.”
Host
Guest
Cale Epperson
person
Paranormal Investigators of Oklahoma
organization
EMF
other
Russell
person
Margaret
person
Tony Brirsky
person
Wi-Fi router
product
Sylvia Brown
person
Toys R Us
brand
Yukon
place
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